Why the Phev ?

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Itchycat1
Posts: 54
Joined: Tue Dec 28, 2021 11:11 pm

Post by Itchycat1 »

Was initially going to order the plug in Ultimate ,until I discovered the additional £325 road tax due for the first 5 years. Taking this additional running cost into account , and the additional cost of installing a power point at home. I can't make sense of why you would buy the phev in favour of the full hybrid ,especially when you take in to account the full hybrid does more mpg than the phev once you have used your full charge (ie ) the first 30 miles or so.
What mileage per year would you need to do to make the plug in a more viable option than the full hybrid or an I missing something?😀

roadster
Posts: 206
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2022 3:01 pm
Location: South Coast

Post by roadster »

Having just taken delivery of the PHEV Premium ( which just drops under the tax threshold) I do understand your misgivings. It is realistic and easy to charge at home via an ordinary 3 pin plug and this takes about 6 hours on the 10 amp setting. The traction battery has a capacity of just under 14 KW.Hours but it is never allowed to go below about 15% hence it will fully charge at a rate of just over 2 KW in that time. I have only done this once so far but the numbers make sense and if you prefer to charge more quickly many of the public charge points will do this. The more elaborate home charging points will be quicker too but as domestic supplies are limited to 30 amps = 7 to 8 KW the investment would not be worthwhile for me. In pure economic terms you are right to question the value of the plug-in but those whose regular trips are short could find they buy very little petrol. High mileage users will probably see no economic benefit.

There are some technical benefits for this particular car because it comes with four wheel drive and a bit more power. Also having a battery that is ten times the capacity of the ordinary hybrid means that it should be safe to leave unused for a far longer time with the 12 volt sub-unit being maintained from the high voltage system.

How all this works out over time I have yet to find out.
Tucson PHEV Premium
Itchycat1
Posts: 54
Joined: Tue Dec 28, 2021 11:11 pm

Post by Itchycat1 »

Cheers for your reply, and I hope you are enjoying your new car. Really wanted the phev myself and still toying over the idea.
I appreciate the phev has more power 265 bhp ? but isn't this lost in performance due to additional weight of the batteries.
Appreciate the first 30 or so miles cheaper whilst running from batteries( but still at a cost) if weather permitting their after unless recharged the economy is less mpg than the hybrid. Factor in £325 additional road tax which probably equates to 3 full tanks 0r 1200 miles per annum, i think the phev would need to do a high mileage in short rechargeable distances to outperform the full hybrid economically.
Trying to work out the maths, as in theory really wanted the phev,but considering the additional cost not mentioned such as installing a power point and difference in price for the card can't quite justify it to myself😁
roadster
Posts: 206
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2022 3:01 pm
Location: South Coast

Post by roadster »

In a nutshell if I hadn't wanted four wheel drive I wouldn't have opted for the plug-in. I'm not expecting any of this on the UK south coast but this video shows just how good the system is in snow:-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIcA5LMIXQA
Tucson PHEV Premium
madowl
Posts: 109
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2022 5:45 pm

Post by madowl »

I'm currently running an MG HS PHEV. The stated EV miles for it is 32 on a full charge. In warmer weather it will manage about 30 ( I live in a very flat area). However if you need to use fast screen clear or some other high load item the ICE will kick in and stay in auto charge mode until you stop using whatever caused it to kick in and then reselect EV mode.
In cooler weather the ICE will want to run until the cabin has warmed (even if you haven't got the heating controls on) and you have to keep checking to see if EV is available. If you need heat the ICE will run anyway as this car doesn't have an electric heater. So in winter it is hard to do the shorter journeys using EV mode.
Also noticed that in auto charge mode the car will still steal enegy from the battery which you may have been saving for use in a busy built up area. If you haven't got any EV mode energy left the ICE will have to work harder to make available some hybrid energy for performance etc.
Not trying to put people off but, in an ideal scenario, you would be at break even point finacially with a HEV at about 100 miles but realistically it would be Summer about 90 miles and cooler months about 60 miles. Even using the same engine PHEVs do around 20% less mpg than HEVs due to the extra weight etc. However my price per kwh is about to more than double so those break even figures will be less. Hope this info helps work out what is best for you.

Actually, thinking about it more, if electricity does go up to say 30p per kwh with a full charge for 30 miles being about 15 kwh that woud be £4.50. The Rav4 hybrid I had before did 50 mpg average around my area and petrol would cost about £6.60 pg against 50 miles on electric £7.50 so it definitely would not make sense financially. I know it is not the only decision criteria though.
roadster
Posts: 206
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2022 3:01 pm
Location: South Coast

Post by roadster »

madowl wrote: Wed Feb 16, 2022 10:48 pm I'm currently running an MG HS PHEV. The stated EV miles for it is 32 on a full charge. In warmer weather it will manage about 30 ( I live in a very flat area). However if you need to use fast screen clear or some other high load item the ICE will kick in and stay in auto charge mode until you stop using whatever caused it to kick in and then reselect EV mode.
In cooler weather the ICE will want to run until the cabin has warmed (even if you haven't got the heating controls on) and you have to keep checking to see if EV is available. If you need heat the ICE will run anyway as this car doesn't have an electric heater. So in winter it is hard to do the shorter journeys using EV mode.
Also noticed that in auto charge mode the car will still steal enegy from the battery which you may have been saving for use in a busy built up area. If you haven't got any EV mode energy left the ICE will have to work harder to make available some hybrid energy for performance etc.
Not trying to put people off but, in an ideal scenario, you would be at break even point finacially with a HEV at about 100 miles but realistically it would be Summer about 90 miles and cooler months about 60 miles. Even using the same engine PHEVs do around 20% less mpg than HEVs due to the extra weight etc. However my price per kwh is about to more than double so those break even figures will be less. Hope this info helps work out what is best for you.

Actually, thinking about it more, if electricity does go up to say 30p per kwh with a full charge for 30 miles being about 15 kwh that woud be £4.50. The Rav4 hybrid I had before did 50 mpg average around my area and petrol would cost about £6.60 pg against 50 miles on electric £7.50 so it definitely would not make sense financially. I know it is not the only decision criteria though.
I've done some shopping trips in the Tucson and it has stayed in electric mode even though its below 10 degrees C. But I have kept the fan off, heated seat on, so no heating demand and the engine has stayed cold. This was even true for a short motorway stretch. You are right about costs though. My electricity price is at 22p KwH so a full charge
( say 12 KwH ) costs £2.64. Some ridiculous fixed price deals are now on offer at well over 30p per KwH at which point petrol may be the cheaper option. Like you my previous car was the Rav4 hybrid but it never averaged 50 mpg in town or local driving although its life-time average was just over 45 mpg and I doubt whether the Tucson will better that. All down to how you want to drive I suppose.
Tucson PHEV Premium
joolstdi
Posts: 264
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2022 7:44 pm
Location: Wales

Post by joolstdi »

Itchycat1 wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 11:20 pm Was initially going to order the plug in Ultimate ,until I discovered the additional £325 road tax due for the first 5 years.
I can predict that after April when the new car tax prices come out there will be a lot of cancellations of orders of Tucson's with models over the 40K band.
Which is a shame but bad for Hyundai.

Jools
Tucson Ultimate PHEV Auto + Teck Pack
Ordered Jan 2022
Delivered June 2022
DrElectron
Posts: 151
Joined: Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:37 am

Post by DrElectron »

joolstdi wrote: Thu Feb 17, 2022 9:53 am
Itchycat1 wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 11:20 pm Was initially going to order the plug in Ultimate ,until I discovered the additional £325 road tax due for the first 5 years.
I can predict that after April when the new car tax prices come out there will be a lot of cancellations of orders of Tucson's with models over the 40K band.
Which is a shame but bad for Hyundai.

Jools
Tax rates are only a minor increase over the current rates. The 40k+ 'luxury tax' has been in place for quite a while now
My first and certainly last Hyundai: 2022 Tucson Phev Ultimate
NLineS
Posts: 48
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 2021 2:16 pm

Post by NLineS »

Bad marketing by Hyundai. I doubt there is anyone out there that has paid £42K list price for a NLineS PHEV? Hyundai should've done away with all the BS discounts and just reduced the list price of the car below the £40K marker.
DrElectron
Posts: 151
Joined: Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:37 am

Post by DrElectron »

Pretty standard across the industry, I bet there are a lot of people who pay list price, but agree that following the 'norms' of the industry isn't exactly a good USP
My first and certainly last Hyundai: 2022 Tucson Phev Ultimate
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